The Tim Tebow as a Pro QB Debate… Winning May Not Be Everything, But it is Something

March 31, 2010

Read the opposing arguments from Loyal Homer and Babe Ruthless.

If sporting events were played on paper, rather than on the field, then we would be getting ready for a Final Four that, besides Duke, also featured Kentucky, Syracuse, and Kansas. Instead we are all getting ready to watch one featuring Butler, Michigan State, and West Virginia. Projection is an inexact science, and as Babe Ruthless points out in his argument, analysts get it wrong just as often as (if not more than) they get it right. Likewise, the challenge of projecting an unproven athlete’s success is just as much guesswork as it is science.

That is why debates such as these are so much fun. There is no right or wrong answer when it comes to prediction and projection, there is only speculation. Only Tim Tebow can ultimately decide if he will be a successful NFL quarterback. All the breakdowns and analysis in the world will not change that inevitable outcome. Still, it does not stop us from trying our hardest at predicting the future!

With that in mind, Loyal Homer is absolutely correct. College success is not a predictor for NFL success. However, it should also be noted that having an unconventional throwing motion is also not a predictor for failure. Just because a quarterback entering the NFL is not considered a pure “passer” does not mean that he will fail.

Bernie Kosar, one of the most successful quarterbacks of the 1980s had a side-arm delivery when he threw the ball. If I were coaching Pop Warner and I saw a kid trying to mimic Kosar’s motion, I would a) cringe, and b) work with him in trying to correct it. However, Kosar made it work.

Another more recent example of a quarterback who has found success in the NFL without relying on a strong passing game is Ben Roethlisberger.

When the Steelers won the Super Bowl in 2005 it was not on the arm of Roethlisberger. During the season, he threw the ball only 268 times that season. By comparison, there were 25 other quarterbacks in the NFL that season with more than 300 passing attempts, led by Brett Favre who had more than 600. Of those completions, Roethlisberger accounted for only 2,385 passing yards (behind 20 other quarterbacks) and 17 touchdowns (behind 13 other quarterbacks).

Even though Roethlisberger was not called upon to be a “passer” in 2005, he helped lead his team to the Super Bowl and is now considered one of the most successful quarterbacks in the game today.

I am not trying to draw comparisons between Roethlisberger and Tebow (I actually think that is the LAST person Tebow would want to be compared with right now). I am simply bringing up the point that a quarterback can be successful without having to rely on a fundamentally “sound” passing game.

It is for that reason that I am awarding the debate to Babe Ruthless.

As Babe Ruthless points out, Tebow possesses other intangible qualities that CAN translate from college into professional success. Namely, he is a WINNER and a proven LEADER (qualities that many people in the NFL severely lack).

You can coach a player on how to change his throwing mechanics. You can help him to study film and learn how to read defenses better. You can teach him how to change his grip on the ball to allow for a cleaner release. But you CANNOT teach him how to be a winner or a leader.

Is Tebow a good fit for EVERY team in the NFL? No, but what quarterback is? That does not automatically mean he is a BAD fit for every team. It may take a few years before he is ready to actually run an NFL offense while he perfects his new and improved throwing style, and that is okay. Aaron Rodgers did not start right out of the gate and he has been one of the best quarterbacks of the past two seasons. However, when the time finally does come and Tebow walks out onto the field one Sunday afternoon, the coach can be confident in the fact that his quarterback knows how to win.

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The Concussions in the NFL Debate – NFL Must Be a Leader For Long-Term Health

December 2, 2009

Read the debate intro and the arguments from Bleacher Fan and Loyal Homer about the NFL potentially insisting players stay out an entire game after a head injury.



Here is an obvious, but important statement: NFL players have a job where they get hit a lot. Sometimes those hits happen in the head. Because of the enduring physical risk NFL players undertake to play football, in part, they receive salaries that many deem excessive. But, this is a job for only a certain time in a person’s life. It is not wrong and selfish for a player to remove themselves from a game because of trouble shaking a concussion. And if the NFL’s embedded locker room culture dictates masking head injuries, the NFL must step up its treatment of injuries that have long-term impact on a person’s post-football career. Loyal Homer is correct – the NFL must protect its players, and one game is not a major sacrifice.

The NFL currently has a retirement plan. That retirement plan has been attacked by 25 different federal lawsuits within the past 10 years. The content of those majority of the lawsuits has involved (you guessed it) disability determinations. In other words, a lot of smart people think the NFL does not do a good enough job taking care of its players when their careers are over, and including a mandatory extra one game out of the lineup for a player who suffers a head injury on the field of play is not just good policy. It simply makes sense.

The lawsuit examples indicate that the NFL already does not do enough to protect the long-term health of its players, though it does profit from their health in the near term. The NFL is – because of the way the game is played and the culture that is permitted within the league – obligated to take care of its players because so many long-term health issues result from playing the game hard.

It is hard to question a player like Hines Ward. Ward is a champion – two times over, to be exact – so he knows what it takes to win. He knows the effort and sacrifice required to attain success at the highest level. When he told NBC, “It’s tough… you don’t want to jeopardize your future. It’s a tossup. You either play and jeopardize your future, or you sit out and worry about the big picture.” The players are conflicted, so the NFL must intervene on behalf of a player’s long-term health. If a player makes his own decision to hold himself out of the lineup he is perceived as weak. However, if he plays and suffers a substantial injury because of the existing one he denied, he is permanently weak. The NFL can and should mediate.

From a business investment stand point it is worth a team’s while to lose a player for a single game over the course of the player’s contract when compared against the possibility of losing the player to injury for their entire career.

Whether it is the competitive nature of the player, as Loyal Homer points out, or the general culture that exists within the league, a person playing with a head injury is a risky thing to do. For fans it is easy to view the players as just that – players. They are business assets with a certain job to do. They are not allowed to make errors, and they are not allowed to succumb to injuries that are unseen by the eye. Fans are wrong in this view, and, strangely, agents are correct. A player’s agent must see a player as a person, with long-term plans, family (or families if you’re Travis Henry), other business interests, etc. Fans sometimes forget that players are people, and this concussion rule is a healthy reminder.

A fight from owners and some league insiders on this issue makes no sense. Why? If a team is unable to go one week without a certain player, then the owner, GM, and coaching staff is not doing a good enough job. The roster may lack depth, the coach is not using players well enough, or the owner has hired the wrong people in key positions. The Colts, in Bleacher Fan’s example, should have a better quarterback playing behind Manning. Fighting over greater protection for players who suffer injuries that science has not fully grasped yet makes no sense.

Bleacher Fan made some interesting points. However, the degree of injury – and the level of scientific understanding about a given injury – is extremely important. Bleacher Fan is also right about the difference between being hurt and being injured. However, head injuries need a different classification. The league must evolve to protect.

Bleacher Fan also mentions that a player’s perception of an injury (life-threatening versus non-life-threatening) impacts a team’s culture. I agree. But when the NFL imposes greater protections for injured players – even though the non-doctor teammates are unable to identify the appearance of an injury – it is changing the perception of the injury. Head injuries are not to be taken lightly anymore. By imposing this “extra day off” rule the NFL is forcing the perception of head injuries to change and shifting the league’s culture. That’s a good thing. While this potential rule is not designed to protect all players from all injuries, it is a positive precedent for the long-term health and viability of the NFL and its human employees.

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The Concussions in the NFL Debate – How Much is Too Much Baby-ing?

December 1, 2009

Read the arguments from Bleacher Fan and Loyal Homer about if staying out an entire game after a head injury is an excessive by the NFL.



How tough are you? How much physical abuse can you take? How willing are you to lay it all on the line for a goal and your teammates?

The answers are very, a lot, and completely. All of those questions are important in the NFL, and players must get each answer correct. No exceptions.

Head injuries, however, complicate that cultural mandate. Head injuries are treated the same in NFL locker rooms as any other injury. The league’s treatment of concussions has been well documented, and now the NFL is changing how it deals with them. Sports Illustrated writer Peter King and Fox Sports insider Jay Glazer are both reporting that the NFL – as soon as next week – will announce new guidelines for how severe head injuries and concussions will be treated. If a player shows that he has lost his bearings after a blow to the head, or suffers any memory loss or amnesia, that player will not be allowed back onto the field for the remainder of that game. Fair enough.

However, like most sticky issues in politics and sports, one constituency believes the NFL is going too far, another believes that the NFL has not gone far enough in protecting its players.

In a league where toughness rules, any player who suffers a head injury during a game is not allowed to reenter the game. A growing contingent believes that the NFL is not going far enough, and that a player should be kept out an additional game after receiving a head injury, no exceptions. This currently unofficial, de facto one game “ban” has already been evident in Arizona with Kurt Warner and Pittsburgh with Ben “I like to stop cars with my face” Roethlisberger. On cue, Pittsburgh wide receiver Hines Ward inferred to the media that Big Ben could have played – if he were tougher.

If not for The Sports Debates, it is hard to imagine this issue getting resolved! Fortunately we are here to answer the following: Should the NFL include a mandatory one-game ban for a player who suffers a head injury on the field?

Loyal Homer argues in favor of expanding the removal of a player who receives a head injury from the remainder of the game where the injury occurs to include the following game as well. Bleacher Fan will argue the “ban” is extreme and not something the league should be allowed to control.

Is this potential rule change and extension fair? Does it signal a culture change in the NFL from a predominantly toughness-centered league to something weaker? Would players whose careers seemingly ended too soon due to head injuries – Al Toon, Harry Carson and Wayne Chrebet, for a few examples – have been prolonged with better post-injury care?

While this debate is bigger than just how the NFL treats players with concussions, let’s stay focused on that for this topic.

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The Best Game To Watch THIS Weekend Debate – Steelers Versus Bears… An OFFENSIVE Showdown?!

September 18, 2009

Read Sports Geek’s and Loyal Homer’s arguments about which game this weekend is the one that you CANNOT miss.

If I told you before the NFL season started that the week two matchup between the Pittsburgh Steelers and the Chicago Bears was the one to watch because of how the team’s respective OFFENSES were going to control the game, you would have laughed at me. However, after injuries last weekend to Bears linebacker Brian Urlacher and Steelers safety Troy Polamalu, that is exactly what the situation is shaping up to be.

The Bears and Steelers are both textbook examples of a “defense-first” mentality. Both organizations confidently feature their defenses, relying on their offenses to a much lesser degree. However, this weekend both are forced to take the field without their key defensive players (the Steelers will still have the NFL’s 2008 Defensive Player of the Year linebacker James Harrison on the field, but it is Polamalu who is undeniably viewed as the leader of their defense). The absence of Urlacher and Polamalu leaves gaping holes in each teams’ defense, and it will be up to their supporting cast to fill in those gaps.

This means that both teams also have an opportunity offensively to capitalize on their opponent’s defensive weakness.

No player on the field will be subject to more scrutiny or have higher expectations placed on him than Bears quarterback Jay Cutler. Following the highly publicized drama around Cutler’s departure from Denver, and the subsequent praise bestowed on the Bears for “finally” bringing in a pro-bowl caliber quarterback for the first time in over 20 years, many expected Cutler to become the final piece of the Bears’ championship puzzle. However, a very disappointing performance against the Green Bay Packers during week one of the season has cast doubt on his ability to carry the team.

The leadership responsibility now lies solely on Cutler’s shoulders to help the Bears succeed offensively. With the matchup this weekend against a significantly less dangerous Pittsburgh defense than if Polamalu were playing, Cutler will have as good an opportunity as any to prove that he was worth all the off-season hoopla. I hope, for his sake, that it works out well for the Bears. If the fans in Chicago booed quarterback Rex Grossman during the 2006 season (the same year when the Bears actually played in the Super Bowl), what do you think they will do to an over-hyped, underperforming prima-donna who fails to live up to expectations (which is exactly how many fans in Chi-Town will perceive Cutler if he cannot perform satisfactorily), no matter how unrealistic those expectations are?

Meanwhile, on the other side of the field, the Steelers will be dealing with their own share of scrutiny and expectation. They may have a much more established offense than Chicago, with players like quarterback Ben Roethlisberger and wide receivers Hines Ward and Santonio Holmes to rely on, but defense has always been the focal point of a Steelers’ game plan.

Last weekend, Pittsburgh struggled offensively for much of the game against the Tennessee Titans, including a late Hines Ward fumble that nearly cost the Steelers the game. This week against the Bears, they can ill-afford to repeat that performance because they will not have a defense that is at full strength to fall back on as a safety-net.

The Steelers-Bears matchup on Sunday in Chicago is going to present a unique test for both teams. On defense, we will find out which player’s injury was more costly to their team (Urlacher or Polamalu), and we will find out which team’s offense is better prepared to carry the load for a weakened defense that cannot be called upon to do everything.

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The Most Devastating NFL Injury Debate – The Steelers Cannot Afford to lose Ben Roethlisberger

August 24, 2009

Read Bleacher Fan and Loyal Homer’s argument for who they believe is potentially the most devastating injury an NFL team can suffer.



Many NFL teams have important players. However, only a few teams in the NFL would be devastated if they lost their most important player. The writers at The Sports Debates believe there are three teams – and three players – who, more than any other team, would be significantly less effective if the player went down to injury. Bleacher Fan will argue the player a team that least afford to lose is safety Ed Reed (Baltimore Ravens) while Loyal Homer will argue the player is quarterback Peyton Manning (Indianapolis Colts).

If there was ever an NFL quarterback who knew how to win without winning pretty, it is Pittsburgh Steelers quarterback Ben Roethlisberger. Big Ben debuted in the NFL in 2004, and won two offensive rookie of the year awards. Since then the awards have dried up, sans the one selection to the Pro Bowl in 2007. He just is not a big time stat producer like some of his fellow quarterbacks in the NFL – Tom Brady and Peyton Manning. Instead, Big Ben is a winner. Now entering his sixth season of professional football, Roethlisberger has two Super Bowl rings. Roethlisberger is the league’s most important player.

Ben Roethlisberger has some skills at quarterback, for sure. But, what he has that most lack is guts and instinct. He has a knack for staying in the pocket and taking the big hits to deliver a pass. He will also stick his neck out in order to gain an extra yard or two on a play (or stop a car). He has an uncanny ability to use his feet to create extra time in the pocket while his receivers get open.

Then there is the ability to lead, measured in the NFL by wins and losses. Roethlisberger has an outstanding all-time regular season record as a starter of 51-20. Against the elite teams in the NFL (we’ll define them as follows: Baltimore Ravens, Carolina Panthers, Chicago Bears, Dallas Cowboys, Indianapolis Colts, New England Patriots, New York Giants, Philadelphia Eagles, San Diego Chargers) he has a respectable regular season record of 15-9. Against his division, the AFC North, he has an all-time record of a whopping 22-4. The supposed biggest rivalry on the Steelers yearly calendar, the Cleveland Browns, have never defeated the Steelers in a game Roethlisberger has played in. He has been so dominant in the battle of the steel cities that the Browns are not even considered a rival anymore (at least they are not considered a rival to the Steelers).

Since Roethlisberger entered the league in 2004 the Steelers compiled a record of 56-24. That means that when Roethlisberger starts at quarterback the Steelers have a winning percentage of 72 percent. Basically, they win three of every four games they play when Big Ben starts under center. Without him the Steelers winning percentage is 56 percent. It is the same defense, the same receivers, the same offensive line, the same running backs – but about a quarter fewer wins. Those stats say something about Roethlisberger’s value.

I cannot make a good argument for Roethlisberger being the most important player to a team in the NFL without talking about his playoff performance. He is lifetime 8-2 in the playoffs – having defeated both NFC teams he has ever faced in the playoffs. He has led three playoff comebacks for victories as well.

We must also talk clutch. Of the 59 career win Roethlisberger has piled up as a starter in the NFL, he has led his team from behind in 19 of them. Eight of those wins happened when he led a scoring drive that ended with less than 43 seconds on the clock (that does not include his two overtime wins). That includes the 2008 Super Bowl when he led a scoring drive that notched the go ahead touchdown against the Arizona Cardinals with just 35 ticks left on the clock.

Roethlisberger wins in the regular season, he wins in the playoffs, and he wins by leading when it matters most, as the seconds tick down. In those clutch, last second drives of the game here are the statistics that Roethlisberger has compiled: completes 74 percent of his passes for 737 yards and six touchdowns. That completion percentage is something to behold.

More, when injury speculation surrounds Roethlisberger, everyone takes it very seriously. The mere specter of an injury to the Steelers’ leader causes a frenzy amongst the Super Bowl media and changes preparation for the opponent. In other words, a single injury rumor about Big Ben impacts how a team prepares for the Steelers.

Roethlisberger’s ability to physically do things in the pocket (and out of the pocket), plus trust his unmatched instincts, separates him from the other quarterbacks in the league. He does not have the Brady’s style or Manning’s extreme smarts. He has his guts, his intuition – and his Super Bowl rings. The Pittsburgh Steelers would not be as dominant year in year out without Roethlisberger. If the Steelers lose him, they lose their identity – and their place in the standings.

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The ESPN Dedicated Local Coverage Debate – Is ESPN Local Coverage Good For Sports, Fans?

July 29, 2009

Read Bleacher Fan’s argument that ESPN dedicated local coverage is good for sports and fans and Loyal Homer’s argument that it is not.



The code of the journalist is to report the story, not become the story. Someone forgot to tell ESPN. It’s important that ESPN learn, too, because they’re hype-machine and in depth coverage is coming to a local market near you.

Last week was a tough week for the World Wide Leader in sports. First, sideline reporter Erin Andrews is illegally taped in a secret recording through a drill hole in a hotel room wall (a despicable act against Andrews, who is a very talented reporter). While that hoopla was just beginning to spiral out of control, ESPN issued a quiet “do not report” alert on the story that Ben Roethlisberger – two time Super Bowl champion quarterback for the Pittsburgh Steelers – is being sued in civil court and being accused of rape. These are very, very serious allegations involving the most recent Super Bowl winning QB, how can ESPN simply refuse to report the story? Well, they delayed reporting it under the guise that no criminal complaints were filed (uh, is that supposed to be an excuse?).

I mention these other stories to add some context to today’s debate topic. ESPN, for better or worse, is setting the bar on sports reporting in the United States, and there’s no one else even close. For over 25 years ESPN has been the go to authority on all national sports. Now they are expanding their national sports reporting dominance to specific markets. First it was Chicago, where ESPN launched a website specially dedicated to all Chicago sports. They recently announced an expansion of the project that will now include New York, Dallas, and Los Angeles.

You may be thinking that even though ESPN WANTS to be relevant in a local marketing like Chicago, they simply do not have the ability to draw the eyeballs that advertisers covet. Wrong. Current local Chicago sports coverage is unwise to dismiss ESPN as a casual threat, especially when considering in June of this year ESPN’s Chicago sports site became the number one more visited sports site in Chicago with 590,000 unique site visits versus The Chicago Tribune’s dedicated Chicago sports site which attracted only 455,000 unique site visits.

Interestingly, because ESPN does not have highly developed reporter assets on the pavement in these local markets, they are, like their hard news counterpart CNN, relying in part on locals to furnish the stories. George W. Bodenheimer, co-chairman of Disney Media Networks and President of ESPN and ABC sports told The New York Times that costs are “minimal” and “the initiative is perfect for exploring [locals covering the news].”

It may seem from the writing of this debate intro that my mind is already made up. However, it’s not. ESPN has found a way to absolve themselves from some of the major (rather questionable) reporting decisions it makes on a day to day basis on the national level and inform its reporting with new technologies like social networks and Twitter. It’s low cost and, like a wild blackberry bush, will provide content that is impossible to control. Since ESPN’s new ombudsman has yet to begin work, the trusty writers at The Sports Debates will tackle the topic.

Today’s debate topic is: Will ESPN’s local market reporting be a viable source for local sports reporting?

Bleacher Fan will argue that ESPN will provides excellent local market coverage and fans stand a lot to gain while Loyal Homer will argue that ESPN will not provide good local coverage and the fans will lose.

Dust off your reporting shoes, writers – what happens when the World Wide Leaders invades your town?

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The 2005 NFL Draft Resign Debate – Atlanta’s Roddy “White” Knight

July 17, 2009

Read Sports Geek’s argument that Aaron Rodgers is the best first round pick from the 2005 NFL Draft and Loyal Homer’s argument that is it DeMarcus Ware.

Do you remember the 2004 NFL Draft? I do…

To help refresh your memory, here are a couple names from that outstanding draft year:

  • Eli Manning (1)
  • Larry Fitzgerald (3)
  • Philip Rivers (4)
  • Sean Taylor (5)
  • Ben Roethlisberger (11)
  •  

This draft was SO loaded with talent that seven of the first ten picks have been named Pro Bowlers, with seven more coming in the remaining first round picks.

So, how is it that just ONE year later, we see one of the most lackluster first rounds in recent NFL draft memory?

In comparison to 2004, the first round of the 2005 NFL Draft has only produced seven total Pro Bowl players, and is highlighted by names like Alex Smith, Adam Jones, and who could forget Alex Barron?! Even the Pro Bowlers have been suspect, such as Braylon Edwards and Shawne Merriman.

But, that doesn’t mean that the first round of the draft was completely devoid of talent. There were still a few diamonds in the rough.

And while Sports Geek will argue for Green Bay quarterback Aaron Rodgers, and Loyal Homer will argue for Dallas linebacker DeMarcus Ware, I look no further than Atlanta Falcons wide receiver Roddy White as THE diamond pick from 2005. At 6’0’’ the 27 year-old out of Alabama-Birmingham has emerged as one of the most dangerous wide receivers in the NFL.

Granted, his career got off to a slow start. In his first two seasons combined with the Atlanta Falcons White only grabbed 59 receptions for 952 yards and three touchdowns. Those are hardly stellar stats.

Itis important to keep something in mind, though, when you look at those numbers. White’s quarterback during those two seasons, one Mr. Ronald Mexico, was not known to be a “passing” quarterback. Instead, Michael Vick’s style was to be a rusher first and a passer second (in 2006, for example, Vick was a 1000 yard rusher, but threw the ball only 388 times). It should also be noted that Vick’s favorite target when he DID throw was his tight end, Alge Crumpler.

It wasn’t until Vick left the Falcons (whatever happened to him anyway?!) that White finally got his opportunity to showcase his tremendous talent.

To replace Vick, the Falcons brought in Joey Harrington at quarterback. Considering the upgrade in “passing” that Harrington brought to the Falcons, it was evident that the Falcon’s offensive game plan was going to be shifting – enter Roddy White.

In 2007, White turned in a season with totals that surpassed the combined results from his first two years with Vick. He caught 83 passes for 1202 yards and six touchdowns. His 1,202 yards was actually eighth in the NFL that season.

The 2008 season brought White a new head coach, Mike Smith, and a new quarterback, rookie sensation Matt Ryan out of Boston College. For White the 2008 NFL season was just another day at the office. Ryan and White were able to connect 88 different times for a total of 1,382 yards (the fourth highest total in the NFL) and seven touchdowns. White’s 2008 performance was so good that it even earned him a spot on the NFC Pro Bowl roster, and he helped the Falcons turn in an 11-5 record and a Wild Card berth in the NFC playoffs.

With a promising young quarterback in Matt Ryan and an explosive running game that features fellow 2008 Pro Bowler Michael Turner, it is very safe to assume that Roddy White’s performances are only going to get better.

If the Atlanta Falcons wish to continue their outstanding momentum which began in the 2008 season, they MUST consider Roddy White as an integral piece of their puzzle, and they MUST sign him to a new contract worthy of any other first round Pro Bowler in the NFL.

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